|
Post by steve on Jul 15, 2024 6:29:10 GMT -5
The Dyatlov Pass Mystery is one of the greatest mysteries of all time, there are plenty of books, youtube vids and TV documentaries about it.. 1- The trackers were probably experienced hikers themselves, so they'd have been fully equipped with torches and skis etc. 2- Below is a pic of the Dyatlovs tent after searchers re-erected it back at base; it had knife cuts all over it as if somebody had tried to slash their way in, or the Dyatlovs had slashed their way out. 3- The bottom line is that nobody has ever been able to explain why the Dyatlovs ran down to the trees partially-clothed, because they must have known they were signing their own death warrants by freezing to death in the subzero conditions. 4- They may have been running to get away from the followers group who were trying to kill them to get their wallet back. Autopsies on the Dyatlovs revealed evidence of a fight- "Mountain of the Dead" book, pages 71-76- "George Krivonischenko- Bruises on hands. Igor Dyatlov..brown/red bruises in the area of the Metacarpophalangeal joints of the right hand. A common injury in fights using fists. Yuri Doroshenko - the fingers of both hands had torn skin. Rustem Slobodin- bruises..in both hands." 5- When searchers later found the abandoned tent, they noticed that clothes were strewn around outside, suggesting that after the injured Dyatlov group had fled down to the trees to get away, the attackers had ransacked the tent, slinging stuff out as they searched for the wallet- MOTD p 60- "Approximately 30-50ft (1-15 m) away from the tent were found shoes, socks and Igor Dyatlov's fur jacket which were lying in the snow. A weatherproof jacket also lay nearby." I've been camping in upstate New York since I was a kid, and I have read a little about the Dyatlov Pass mystery. Noises sound different at night, but I'm assuming these people, being experienced campers, would know that. Also, there was snow and thick snow cover muffles sound. So, if the military was dropping landmines, then the group could have misjudged how close it was, but if a landmine didn't hit the tent, why was there evidence of fire inside the tent? Another thing that I know from what I've read is that the tracks of the hikers were still there when the people looking for them got to the site and they followed the tracks to some of the bodies. If the tracks of the hikers were there more than 3 weeks later, and if they were attacked by a group of people trying to recover a wallet, then the tracks of the attackers would have been there also. As for the ransacking inside the tent, that could have been caused by the hasty retreat of the campers or small animals in search of food. It's evident that birds, probably ravens, fed on some of the bodies because their eyes and tongues were missing and birds feed on the soft parts of a body.
|
|
|
Post by jason on Jul 15, 2024 6:34:53 GMT -5
4- They may have been running to get away from the followers group who were trying to kill them to get their wallet back. Autopsies on the Dyatlovs revealed evidence of a fight- "Mountain of the Dead" book, pages 71-76- "George Krivonischenko- Bruises on hands. Igor Dyatlov..brown/red bruises in the area of the Metacarpophalangeal joints of the right hand. A common injury in fights using fists. Yuri Doroshenko - the fingers of both hands had torn skin. Rustem Slobodin- bruises..in both hands." In a situation like this, it would be difficult for a medical examiner to say, with any degree of medical certainty, how a person received a specific injury. You also cite the fact that Ygor Dyatlov had brown/red bruises in the metacarpophalangeal joints of his right hand, but wasn't he left-handed? Left-handed people hit with their left hands, so if he sustained those brown/red bruises from a fight, they would more than likely be on his left hand.
|
|
|
Post by Dropship on Jul 16, 2024 18:24:30 GMT -5
I've been camping in upstate New York since I was a kid, and I have read a little about the Dyatlov Pass mystery. Noises sound different at night, but I'm assuming these people, being experienced campers, would know that. Also, there was snow and thick snow cover muffles sound. So, if the military was dropping landmines, then the group could have misjudged how close it was, but if a landmine didn't hit the tent, why was there evidence of fire inside the tent? Another thing that I know from what I've read is that the tracks of the hikers were still there when the people looking for them got to the site and they followed the tracks to some of the bodies. If the tracks of the hikers were there more than 3 weeks later, and if they were attacked by a group of people trying to recover a wallet, then the tracks of the attackers would have been there also. As for the ransacking inside the tent, that could have been caused by the hasty retreat of the campers or small animals in search of food. It's evident that birds, probably ravens, fed on some of the bodies because their eyes and tongues were missing and birds feed on the soft parts of a body. 1- If the area was a military testing area why wasn't it marked on hikers maps to warn hikers to stay clear? 2- They had a stove, it's the L-shaped chimney sticking out of their tent in this pic on a previous expedition, but I haven't heard there was a fire in the tent- 3- If the wallet group were following in the tracks of the Dyatlovs, both groups tacks in the snow would have looked the same. 4- Was Dyatlov lefthanded? I've not heard that before. But as always the Big Question that nobody has been able to answer in the past 60 years is WHY did they run down to the trees in the middle of the night partially-clothed in subzero conditions, they must have KNOWN they were running to their deaths.
|
|
|
Post by jason on Jul 17, 2024 5:59:14 GMT -5
1- If the area was a military testing area why wasn't it marked on hikers maps to warn hikers to stay clear? 2- They had a stove, it's the L-shaped chimney sticking out of their tent in this pic on a previous expedition, but I haven't heard there was a fire in the tent- 3- If the wallet group were following in the tracks of the Dyatlovs, both groups tacks in the snow would have looked the same. 4- Was Dyatlov lefthanded? I've not heard that before. But as always the Big Question that nobody has been able to answer in the past 60 years is WHY did they run down to the trees in the middle of the night partially-clothed in subzero conditions, they must have KNOWN they were running to their deaths. 1. Don't tell me you actually trust the government to tell people everything, and the Soviet government was even more secretive than other governments. 2. The searchers found 9 sets of footprints left by the hikers and followed them down to the edge of the woods, a distance of almost a mile. If someone had been chasing them, then the footprints of those doing the chasing would have been evident, and if the people who followed them to recover the wallet didn't chase then, why would they have run that distance? 3. People's strides are different, and it would have been close to impossible for the "chasers" to step into the tracks left by the hikers in the daytime, it would have been absolutely impossible in the dark with only flashlights to guide them. 4. There's a photo of Dyatlov with his watch on his right wrist and most people wear watches on their right wrist only if they're left-handed. Also, the reason some of the campers were almost naked is because some of the other survivors took the clothing of those who died. There was also evidence some of them were trying to make it back to the tent, so those who did try to return had to have been confident the danger had passed.
I've never understood why they didn't set up camp closer to the woods, where they would have had some protection against the elements.
|
|
|
Post by Dropship on Jul 17, 2024 7:10:48 GMT -5
1- The relatives of the dead hikers raised quite a stink about it and demanded to know what happened, but the Soviet govt admitted they didn't know, instead of inventing a baloney story to try to cover it up. 2/3- The footprints were probably close together and mashed up the snow, making it impossible to know which were the Dyatlovs and which were the alleged followers. 4- Even if Dyatlov was left handed his hand might still have got injured fending off blows from attackers. 5- They may well have taken clothes off the bodies, but that brings us back to why they didn't grab as many clothes as they could from the tent before heading down to the trees- MOTD book 60- "Approximately 30-50ft (1-15 m) away from the tent were found shoes, socks and Igor Dyatlov's fur jacket which were lying in the snow. A weatherproof jacket also lay nearby."
WIKI- "Although the temperature was very low, around −25 to −30 °C (−13 to −22 °F) with a storm blowing, the dead were only partially dressed. Some had only one shoe, while others wore only socks. Some were found wrapped in snips of ripped clothes that seemed to have been cut from those who were already dead"
6- Yes, some tried to return to the tent later but froze to death, but exactly what "danger" made them flee in the first place? 7- And yes, as a camper mysefl i'd certainly have set up my tent in the woods, but perhaps if the Dyatlovs knew they were being followed they decided to press on for almost a mile up the mountain slope in the hope that the followers would give up the chase. Below: a modern picture with the tent location marked with flags. The trees are almost a mile away down the shallow slope. And their original hiking destination was Mt Otorten 9 miles away on the horizon at extreme left, yet they seem to have diverted from the direct route to it, perhaps in an attempt to throw any followers off their trail. MOTD book p 31/32 "..they appear to have lost their way and ended up on the eastern slope of Kholat Syakhl ('Mountain of the Dead') rather than Mount Otorten..as they had originally intended..."
|
|
|
Post by snowfairy on Jul 17, 2024 8:19:18 GMT -5
2/3- The footprints were probably close together and mashed up the snow, making it impossible to know which were the Dyatlovs and which were the alleged followers. Did they walk or ski to the campsite?
I've read that they leveled out the snow to pitch their tent and that can be dangerous. I still don't understand why they didn't set up camp near the woods instead of out in the open. But when you level out an area of snow, it can cause the snow above to become unstable. I think it's more likely that a slab of snow hit the tent than that a group of people followed them over a hundred miles to retrieve a wallet. I think you said in one comment that they may have set up camp in the open because they were being followed, but that doesn't make any sense. If you're trying to avoid someone who's following you, then you'd be much safer setting up camp in the woods where you could easily hide. Besides there were 9 of them, so unless the phantom man with the missing wallet was able to raise a small army, the hikers could have overpowered the intruders.
Also, the tent wasn't in all that much disarray. It's my understanding that the searchers found food sliced up on a plate.
|
|
|
Post by Dropship on Jul 18, 2024 3:51:07 GMT -5
No matter whether they set up camp in trees or the open, the followers would still have been able to follow their tracks in the snow, but by pushing on another mile and camping of the open slope perhaps they were hoping the followers would get tired and give up tracking them. Yes a slab of snow might have hit the tent but that still doesn't explain why they abandoned the tent and ran down to certain death in the trees. The Russian army (82nd Radio-Technical Regiment) had its HQ in Serov (where the wallet incident happened) and also had a facility in Ivdel, so perhaps the wallet owner was part of a large group of soldiers on a hiking trip who all tracked the Dyatlovs to get the wallet back.
|
|
|
Post by Sam on Jul 18, 2024 4:11:09 GMT -5
Yes a slab of snow might have hit the tent but that still doesn't explain why they abandoned the tent and ran down to certain death in the trees. If a slab of snow hit the tent, they wouldn't know what was happening. If there was cut up food on a plate, like someone said, then they were obviously eating and getting ready for bed after a long hike -- some of them might have already been in bed. Being experienced skiers, and hearing a slab of snow coming down on them, they would probably have initially thought that it was an avalanche. Also, it was dark, someone said the moon didn't rise until after midnight and a final quarter moon gives hardly any light at all, so once they ran a distance from the tent, they wouldn't have known where they were or how to get back.
|
|
|
Post by snowfairy on Jul 18, 2024 10:27:38 GMT -5
No matter whether they set up camp in trees or the open, the followers would still have been able to follow their tracks in the snow, but by pushing on another mile and camping of the open slope perhaps they were hoping the followers would get tired and give up tracking them. Yes a slab of snow might have hit the tent but that still doesn't explain why they abandoned the tent and ran down to certain death in the trees. The Russian army (82nd Radio-Technical Regiment) had its HQ in Serov (where the wallet incident happened) and also had a facility in Ivdel, so perhaps the wallet owner was part of a large group of soldiers on a hiking trip who all tracked the Dyatlovs to get the wallet back. Have you ever tried to follow tracks in the snow at night when there's no moonlight?
People reportedly saw what they described as orange lights in the sky where the Dyatlov party was camping that night. The most probable explanation is that the lights were flares because the military was carrying out some kind of operations in the area that night, whether they admit it or not. Our own US military doesn't always tell the truth about military operations and neither does yours, so why would you think the Soviets would admit to dropping landmines, or whatever they were doing, that ended up causing the deaths of 9 people? They wouldn't.
Did you know that there's a weird warning sound before an avalanche? If the military was dropping landmines and the hikers heard a strange sound, they could have mistaken it for an impending avalanche and run for their lives. An avalanche can be spread out over hundreds of feet, so if they thought they were about to be buried in tons of snow, they would have put as much distance between themselves and the tent as possible, which is probably why they all ended up in the woods. They were all running together in that direction and like someone else said, because it was dark and there was no moonlight, they wouldn't have been able to find their way back to the tent in a landscape covered in snow.
If the man who supposedly accused someone in the Dyatlov party of taking his wallet was in the military, and there's no evidence that he was, but stretching it even more and saying that he was and he and a group of soldiers where on a hiking trip, which is REALLY stretching it, the chances that he was able to convince his buddies to travel cross-country to retrieve a wallet instead of keeping to their schedule is just unbelievable.
I've now said all I have to say on this subject. I have an interest in unsolved mysteries, but this discussion is just getting a little too "out there" for me.
|
|
|
Post by Dropship on Jul 20, 2024 5:53:54 GMT -5
Incidentally this pic of some of the Dyatlovs en route to the hiking area seems to show a demonic face (circled) which might be an optical illusion-
|
|
|
Post by jason on Jul 20, 2024 6:23:25 GMT -5
Incidentally this pic of some of the Dyatlovs en route to the hiking area seems to show a demonic face (circled) which might be an optical illusion- It's called "pareidolia."
|
|
|
Post by Dropship on Jul 21, 2024 3:20:01 GMT -5
Thanks, I just looked it up in the dictionary- "PAREIDOLIA: the perception of apparently significant patterns or recognizable images, especially faces, in random or accidental arrangements of shapes and lines", so I think we can rule out any connection between the "demon face" and one of the most baffling mysteries of all time..
|
|